Basic Entry Level Camera and Tablet Set-up Recommendations Please

[J.T]

OK, so after the East Coast Doll Meet, and witnessing the ease of using a digital camera with a tablet connection, I want to try this out.

I’ve done some poking around and for a basic entry level set-up many recommendations propose the following:

• Canon EOS Rebel T7
• 10" tablet (IOS or Android)

Before I go deeper into our research, I wanted to put this out there to the many more experienced photographers.

What would you recommend?
Is there another entry level camera you would recommend?

I welcome your thoughts, comments, and recommendations.

Many Thanks in advance.

[Leatherman]

I started out looking at the canon rebels but I ended up spending a little more and got a Sony a7iii. I have had it 4 years now and have no regrets nor have I felt the need to upgrade. I bought the body only and decided on a Sigma 50mm lens. Nancy and I have been using iPad pros for years and they have been very reliable. https://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/1394217-REG/sony_ilce_7m3_alpha_a7_iii_mirrorless.html/?ap=y&ap=y&smpadsrd=&store=420&smp=y&lsft=BI%3A514&gad_source=1&gad_campaignid=21061288000&gbraid=0AAAAAD7yMh1KSuCwmL-yR-7DuMvNod3Az&gclid=CjwKCAiAw9vIBhBBEiwAraSATl-cdK9ajp5My9JFme2FNhFd5IIMnt0SMHzXSlU_2Yth86JG4I2vhhoCiA4QAvD_BwE

[DollDestinyX]

I would recommend full frame mirrorless.

Full frame for easy and cheaper choice of lenses.
And mirrorless for easy integration with new apps etc.

I don’t believe there any advantage in APS-C sensor in a modern world. It rather marketing. Canon was ignoring this format for long time in the mirrorless format.

Keep in mind, camera is a platform, armament is your lenses. Not just buying F16 or A-10C for their look, and then trying to match you favorite bombs just to figure out they are not compatible with your platform

With canon most affordable and artistic lenses are:

• RF 50mm 1.8 ~$150 used (can’t find cheaper and better) able to focus closer than other brands
• RF 45mm 1.2 $450+tax was just announced and no used one. Incredible wide aperture for $
• RF 85mm IS F/2 macro. ~$500. image stabilization, able to focus close for lips, eyes, smardolls.

This is a modern full frame lenses, that is much better any DSLR, specially APS-C versions

For zooms you can look at either:
RF 28-70 f/2.8 IS wider aperture but shorter zoom range
RF 24-105 f/4 IS smaller aperture, but wide zoom range, weather sealed
Both image stabilized. About $900

Now the platform for RF mount is either:

• R8 below $900 or so used (but check local Offer-Up)
• RP below $600 or so used (but check local Offer-Up)

RP is an older version of R8. And I would buy if budget is absolutely required.

I would avoid Rebel for:

• it is crop. That limit choice to mediocre lens line up. Forces to cost ineffective choices and make life just harder.
• it is not mirrorless. You will miss all new experience and learning curve will be harder.

I like Canon, as they joined mirrorless movement at the last moment. And was able to learn on Sony mistakes. RF is one of largest diameter mount, that simplify some optical solutions. They have either expensive lenses, or very cheap and incredibly efficient lenses. There is a moan that they not allowing 3rd party lenses, that I don’t see need to. The recent 45mm f/1.2 for $450 one more argument to prove it.

You can’t find better than R8 hybrid camera that shoots 40fps stills and 10bit HDRs videos. Not to mention 180fps slow motion etc. for only $800. But that about camera, lens are even better

To sum up. Cheapest entry is: Canon RP + RF 50mm 1.8. If budget allows, get better lens. Camera can be upgraded later. Lenses are main tools, loosing value very slow, good investment. RF mount is the latest from Canon and unlikely change in many years. EF lenses can be mounted over adapter, but it add cost, weight and newer RF lenses are just better by optical design. I would not look to start from outdated technology.

[DollDestinyX]

For photography I would look at Apple only. They do CARE about color calibration of their devices. iPad Pro 11 or 13 versions also support extended color gamut for HDR (apple brand it as XDR). There was a significant bump in screens with M4 based models. But I bet all of them M1-M5 are great devices.
Alternatively MacBook Pro on M1 (I own one) and later chips are doing just fine. MacBook Air will also be just fine (it only missed HDR colors).

I would say some iPad Pro 11 inch. One that has XDR display. Maybe starts from M1, not sure.
I am looking for iPad Pro 11 M4 with 5G. But as I use intensively filters on photoshop, I may just stay on MacBook as more universal device.

[Miho]

For Canon I’d look at package deals for Canon 6D if you want wireless control from laptop/ipad etc.

[JustDude]

Hey, glad you had fun at the last doll meet and found it to be inspirational!

What you’re describing (linking the camera with tablet or PC etc) is called tethering. There are two main ways to do this, either via wifi or via a LAN cable. Most entry cameras enable you to do this with a cable, some higher brands will let you do this with local wifi (like Sony).

I suspect you got this from Mishka who likes using his tablet for visualizing shots before pressing the trigger. It’s a great feature on his Sony A7r IV. I’m not sure it’s available on the ‘‘lower end’’ Sony cameras, but I do know the compatibility is, indeed, better with Apple products. This style of photography is great when using a tripod.

Having said that, cameras are not exactly the same than phones where their AI does all the work for you. Having a camera is more like driving a manual car VS automatic, except more demanding. I’d highly advise you to look at beginners courses on youtube to se if you’d even like to go down that expensive rabbit hole.

I personally have found that I like to freehand my photos (no tripod) and this kinda defeats the purpose of using the tethering method. But this all happens with baby steps. I say look up camera beginner videos (learn about ‘‘the photography triangle’’) and if it all intrigues you then think about spending a couple of thousand bucks, then maybe one or two more eventually.

[Mr_Fix_it]

Yeah, I agree with @JustDude your own photography style depends a lot on you, your influences and your tried and true experience. That said you’ll need to try a few different strategies, ie: hand held, tripod, DSLR, Mirror-less among other things or a combination of. (I shoot both hand held and tripod). Each of these have their own advantages and disadvantages. The one constant is “Lens quality” Cannot stress this enough. So If you’re lucky enough to have a camera store near by that will rent out gear to try, I’d recommend doing just that to get a feel for what’s out there and how it fits with what you are aiming for.
Cheers

[DollDestinyX]

I just realised that the goal was not to get into new camera. But to shoot on iPad. I should check if RP can shoot on the app. More likely it can. So does R8. But I never shoot this way.
I think your desire is connected to ability to see clear the shot you just did.

Maybe you should consider mirrorless even more. They do use electronic viewfinder. That is basically a screen with magnifying glass. You put eye into and scroll images that you just shoot. In wide angle, seeing all colours and details. iPad may show it better, but it is not always convinient.

Because our eyes seeing different to the camera, mostly due to different dynamic range and intensive brain post-processing. Photographers on DSLR and film, and specially flash photographers need to develop skill to predict results to tune light and camera, while viewfinder of SLR just show content in a frame (cant see result).

On the contrary mirrorless camera, show colors as camera see all the time before the shot. Pretty much as a phone does, combined with constant light, making process easy and predictable. And viewfinder allow to see it without breaking eyes watching on a tiny screen of DSLR camera or smartphone.

DSLRs have a “live view” mode. That turns them into mirrorless camera without viewfinder, just with a tiny back screen. Disadvantage is normally very poor autofocus, specially at dark, and not able to see small details not during, not after shot. Pretty much a large smartphone with attached lens.

I would look at mirrorless camera equipped with viewfinder. My camera recommendations would remain the same for Canon. R8 with RF 50mm or 45mm. R6 will have a better viewfinder resolution. Best option is to rent camera to try, or borrow during event. I borrowed my camera to friends during last event.

The EVF electronic viewfinder has a diopters adjustment, so that can be tuned for any vision correction.

[DollDestinyX]

Forgot to say. Sony A7iii and Canon RP was not always able to find and focus on eyes as good as later models. It was terrible with smartdoll and anime faces. I always complained that Japanese camera cant shoot Japanese anime! That improved a lot with RP->R8.

New mirrorless eyes are always spot on into pupils not eyelashes or eyebrow. No need iPad to check. Even on f/1.2

I think Sony improved the same, but I sold all my Sony. Cant say.
So it worth getting recent mirrorless camera, it allows to forget about missing eyes focus.

Lenses (specially native) designed for mirrorless cameras focuses slightly better. Another reason not to save $10 on adopted DSLR or 3rd party lenses. In my opinion not worth it in long term of lens ownership ~15years or so.

[Mr_Fix_it]

Hi @DollDestinyX I just have one concern about your statement on DSLR.

@DollDestinyX

not able to see small details not during, not after shot

This statement, at least for my Pentax K1 Mk II DSLR is untrue. In “Live view” I can zoom in 16X during and after the shot. Also Pentax has their own app for WiFi shooting with tablet or phone.
Cheers

[Miho]

Oh, almost forgot to include this: https://explorecams.com/

You can look at example pictures and also see what lens, ISO, exposure etc the pictures are taken with.

I’ll still recommend a Canon 6D for shooting dolls or portraits in general, since it’s close to the D2000 (T7) in price but outperforms it in a huge way.
Professional portrait shooters still use it, for a reason.

If you want to spend more I would look for a Nikon 850D, D4, 800D or 750D, the 850D is still Nikons best camera.

I find you don’t really need autofocus for taking doll pictures, I personally use manual lenses for the most part along with a tripod and ipad, get perfect focus 99.99% of the time by doing digital zoom in and set the focus manually.

You want good lights, but those can be gotten fairly cheap as well, spotlight bicolor lights are great and so are the light wands/tubes.

Here is my setup, I have a older Canon 5D Mark III from before they got WiFi so I use a 3rd party option called CamFi which makes it work on the ipad.

Here I am taking a picture with a 50mm Olympus Zuiko manual focus lens from like 1980.

As you can see the picture is perfectly acceptable, Cameras newer than this only really added autofocus and video features which meant reducing the delay between each picture taken in the sensor and processor which really only made them worse for taking pictures, even if their stats are objectively better the pictures don’t look better, in my opinion.

[Johnmagicnl]

I think the previous posters have already covered a lot of good points, so I’ll just add my own experience. My personal choice is the Canon EOS RP (full-frame mirrorless). I use this camera myself and I’m very happy with it. I tether it both to my Samsung tablet and to my laptop, and that workflow is incredibly convenient for my doll photography.

One thing I really want to emphasize is lighting. You can have the best camera in the world, but if you’re shooting indoors you absolutely need good light. I’m using two Nanlite FS-300B constant light units, some tube lights, and a SmallRig RC10 — and they make a huge difference. Eventually you’ll also want to modify that light, for example with softboxes, to make it softer and more flattering.

I completely understand your question about an entry-level camera, but just keep in mind that the journey doesn’t end there. The camera is only one part of the setup.

I also recommend checking YouTube for some solid lighting tutorials — they help a lot.

[DollDestinyX]

I still can’t use that photography of dolls is rather “nature morte” or “still-life”. I hold camera in hand and walk around a doll for best angles as it would be a human. I practice skills that I can use later on people. I delegate a lot to the new technology. Autofocus and EVF offload lot of skills I learn long time ago.

I remember aiming camera to the eyes. Select middle focus point, try to aim to the eye. Once locked, move camera closer half inch, because camera catching eyebrow or eyelashes. Zoom in and check check what got in focus. Learn which of my lenses back focusing and which front focusing. Do 10th of shots just in case it missed focus etc. Now life is much easier, some skills become absolute but still fun to practice.

It was mentioned that DSLR can show result in great details by zooming in. It can, but it also create this need to tether to iPad, because I would not be able to see both details and entire composition. But with EVF I can see better, almost as it would be a tablet screen. Plus I can zoom, or use fingers to zoom in and pan on the back screen.
Long time ago there was skills to shoot on glass plates. And see result in details almost instant, took only 20-30 minutes to process and print And artists were able to create good shots, weddings were shoot on film, no complaint.

I see people carry $3k dolls, but feel bad about getting modern photography gear that cost a fraction of it. New tech is lot of fun, and it is not that expensive.

I will add some pictures that will be difficult to get without new tech.

[poppy70]

When I started with a decent camera I went to a shop that had various cameras on offer and asked if I could try them for a short while - half an hour or so. Canon, Nikon, Sony, Fuji, Olympus and whatnot but in the end I liked the usability of Fuji best and since then I love them.

Most modern cameras have very similar performance and each brand has it’s specific strengths and weaknesses. Else they are very similar.

When deciding for a camera system also take into account which lenses are available. Which quality, what third party lenses are there.

I am biased, because I love my Fuji cameras and most of my fotos need very little tweaking in post, so I would recommend Fuji, however it is definitely not a cheap brand. And it has only either APS-C or Medium Format which is even more expensive. Fuji simply skipped Full Frame.

YMMV, so good luck finding the camera you love to use and take photos with.